VControl with VBar Silverline..beginner questions

Hi Alfred,

OK, then kindly let me know the serial no.

If there was the Recovery firmware on it, it would exactly look like that, too, no Log available but device accessible (to load one of the operating firmwares).

Best,

Eddi

Born to fly ...
forced to work.

I type it in and see if I can attach the screen shot, which is on the Acer Tablet.
So the number is: 1410036286

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540

Hi Alfred,

OK, so it's still unregistered and has 5.3 Express on it, hence no log file.

I guess 'Ready' will light up once you make any changes.

You can self-register right away, just leave the 'giving' MikadoID at info@ ... it's the factory default.

Kind regards

Eddi

Born to fly ...
forced to work.

Thanks Eddi
I will have a play and see if I can't get this damn driver to work on my 17 inch laptop before taking the next step and converting it to version 6 for VControl.
But in the meantime I will go ahead with the registration, thanks.

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540

All good, transfer (or register of ownership took mere seconds). I have added VBar Control Version 6 pro.
So next steps...get Laptop working...upgrade to version 6, then somehow get satellite receiver working on the Silverline and finally get VControl TX bind to the unit.
Should just take a minute...LOL.

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540

Time's relative

Born to fly ...
forced to work.

This is just embarrassing
It now took me less then 60 seconds to get the drivers installed and working on the big Laptop...you were right Eddi, I went down to many levels in the Sub folders for it to find the correct drivers....strange as I tried both folders and all 4 drivers....never mind that's fixed.
Then less then a minute to upgrade it to ver. 6 and another 20 seconds to bind it to VControl.
So tonight I can go ahead and specify the servos in VBar that are on the Goblin, before reinstalling all the equipment and sort the rest of the heli itself out. This proved necessary before actually setting up the heli for the FBL.
The heli just wasn't build to my personal standard and is being rebuild from the ground up.

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540

phew ... probably just a glitch in the Matrix ...

Best,

Eddi

Born to fly ...
forced to work.

VControl
It's got a 3 position switch that is OFF/Idle/Run
What does "idle" on electric helies do???

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540

Idle is active AFTER run and gives a HS for AR training AND a faster Spoolup for recovery (using VGov). On other ESC it can enable their own AR Training mode.

regards (EN) / Gruss (DE)

Rainer Vetter

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
Posting and answering - please use a PC and a standard keyboard. Answer all questions fully, take the needed time, don't forget probably requested attachments.

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After a very busy couple of weeks at work, I am back onto the Goblin.
I have programmed the ESC and now I need to setup the VBar Silverline via VControl

So all servos are disconnected and I will power the Silverline up via the Gryphon regulator.

1) During the Wizard setup, can I stop at any time if I have to and if I do so, do I have to start from scratch???

2) After the basic setup is done and I am ready for 1st flight..what do you power up first??? The VControl TX then the BEC..i.e Silverline and last the ESC for the Motor

or

The ESC for the motor and then the rest????

This might sound silly, but I am a Nitro boy. This is my 1st adventure into big electrics

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540

You can stop setup always after the initial model selection and proceed with the edit setup menue entry later.

Power on vbc first, then the bec and as last the esc would be the safe way.

regards (EN) / Gruss (DE)

Rainer Vetter

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
Posting and answering - please use a PC and a standard keyboard. Answer all questions fully, take the needed time, don't forget probably requested attachments.

Für Posts und Antworten bitte einen PC und eine richtige Taststaur benutzen sowie alle Fragen vollständig abarbeiten. Nehmt Euch Zeit, beantwortet Rückfragen in Ruhe und vollständig.
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
Für Einzelkommunikation bitte ausschließlich Email verwenden! - PN, Messenger, Chat usw. werden nicht bearbeitet.
For single user communication please send a email only! PM, Messenger, Chat etc. won't be read.

Thanks Rainer
I wasn't sure if Vcontrol/Silverline had to see the ESC during power up to set the throttle position.

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540

The good/the bad/and the ugly
Now got it 90% set up.

1) 1st issue.....nothing on the TX screen, except for "User defined screen not Found"..or something similar. I haven't found a way of setting it up. The default screen was there before starting the setup wizard.....now what????
I am using the ICE HV2 160 governor for now, so no VControl governing for the time being. But I need to setup the different values for different headspeeds...where?????

Once the above are sorted, I will remove all the blades and run the motor up to make sure that all works as it should.
This should do for the moment to just get the basic test flights in.

It's getting close

By the way......setup was really easy so far and setting up a 2nd model will be child's play
So far very happy with the experience.

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540

Hi Alfred,

if you have the User Defined Main Screen (UDMS) App installed, you need to set up screens for every model. See here.

You can disable the App in Transmitter Settings/Application enable, and the default screens will appear.

With the ESC, you can use the governor if you use an external brushless phase sensor.
Otherwise, you would set up for external governor and set different throttle values instead. See here.

Kind regards

Eddi

Born to fly ...
forced to work.

Eddi E. aus G. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hi Alfred,
>
> if you have the User Defined Main Screen (UDMS)
> App installed, you need to set up screens for
> every model. See here.

Thanks

>
> You can disable the App in Transmitter
> Settings/Application enable, and the default
> screens will appear.
>

Thanks...fixed, now it shows a proper screen when the heli is connected.

> With the ESC, you can use the governor if you use
> an external brushless phase sensor.

Yes, I have the hobby wing phase sensor here, but not installed yet. At the moment, I want to keep things simple, i.e KISS (Keep it simple stupid). There is a fair amount to sort out 1st, like blade tracking, head speed, throws, agility....etc.

> Otherwise, you would set up for external governor
> and set different throttle values instead. See
> here.

Excellent. I have programmed the ESC with the Castle Link software, which gives me the correct throttle percentage. The only thing in you link is that it shows different percentage values between the Castle Link software GUI snapshot and the VControl values, as shown in the example, when they should be the same.
Just an oversight in the example or difference between Castle and VControl???
>
> Kind regards
>
> Eddi

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540

Hi Alfred,

to the best of my knowledge, only an oversight.

Best,

Eddi

Born to fly ...
forced to work.

Ladies and Gentlement....the heli flies
Very well actually, VBar was a none event and I ended up doing some serious high speed moves. The feel is on the money. It actually has a natural feel to it, a lot better then you find on the Sim. It's half way between the Sim and a Flybar heli.

A few things to sort out yet.

1) The motor seems to get quite hot...not that you can't touch it but to the point that you wouldn't keep you fingers on it indefinitely after 5 minutes of flight. Compared to my son's Align 550 where the motor is just slightly warm after a flight. The Lipo's that came with it are barely warm and show 3.85Vdc after 5 minutes....so no issue there.

2) The heli wobbles at 1540rpm, which improved once switched to 1750rpm (not perfect but far far better).
There was virtually no vibes when I ran it up on the bench without blades. The blades are also in track, so no vibes from there.

I am utterly happy with the feel of the heli and don't really want to change anything except do the auto trim flight and sort out the heat in the motor and the wobble.

And of course get the Mikado current sensor and the battery ID's installed working.

My son took some pictures and videos so I might get a picture up here.

Thanks for all the help so far, it's been a very smooth journey with great success and just a few more steps left to complete.

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540

Here is a picture of just coming in from a bit of high speed flying.

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540

Well done!



regards (EN) / Gruss (DE)

Rainer Vetter

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
Posting and answering - please use a PC and a standard keyboard. Answer all questions fully, take the needed time, don't forget probably requested attachments.

Für Posts und Antworten bitte einen PC und eine richtige Taststaur benutzen sowie alle Fragen vollständig abarbeiten. Nehmt Euch Zeit, beantwortet Rückfragen in Ruhe und vollständig.
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
Für Einzelkommunikation bitte ausschließlich Email verwenden! - PN, Messenger, Chat usw. werden nicht bearbeitet.
For single user communication please send a email only! PM, Messenger, Chat etc. won't be read.

Hi Alfred,

+1

The motor ... what we consider warm or hot is nothing to the motor. With settings of the ESC (higher frequency, hotter, lower frequency, cooler), you can possible do something if it's not already at the low end. On the other hand, bear in mind that you have a 700 here where you draw much more power than on a 550, and you have an almost closed fuselage, where cooling is less than on a pod'n boom. I wouldn't put too much time in it, it's most probably just the way it is. A simple and non-scientific example: if you draw like 5 kW and have an efficiency of 90 % (if it was that way ...), you had 500 W of power dissipation. Now imagine a light bulb with "only" 100 W power, can you touch it? Even though the motor is constantly ventilating air thorugh it's bell, it will easily heat up to a degree where you can barely hold your fingers to the bell.

The wobble ... is related to the dampening and temperature and head speed. There will be head speeds where you run into resonance. You can avoid that by slightly changing the head speed, or if you really want to run that particular head speed, change the dampening to softer (if possible).

That's about it ... enjoy

Kind regards

Eddi

Born to fly ...
forced to work.

Thanks for the responses.
I lost email notifications again for this topic again LOL.

Next steps
1) I have to take the drive belt off and count the pinion gear teeth as my actual rpm is exactly 100rpm lower then set in the governor per bank. I am assuming that the previous owner must have used a different pinion then default.

2) Soldered EC5 connectors onto the UI sensor but will have to cut them all off again. The cabling is way too long between ESC and batteries when the UI sensor is added. I will have to shorten the the ESC output lead as well to keep it all within reasonable limits.

3) After that, the Battery ID system has to be added.

I am sure I will be back with more questions when I get to these parts on the weekend.

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540

Note to everybody....Goblins are not good for additional electronics. Still working on how to add the UI and battery ID. This bird has no room at all.

Now a million questions. Haven't done a trim flight yet as by the time I finally found the dam Trim flight enable, I had used both my sticks.

1) I found the message part in the radio and it showed multiple messages of vibration alert, but there was no access to get more details. How do I access the info??.
Note, the bird is very smooth with no visible vibes but the SAB blades are rubbish as they start barking in even normal flight. I just need to confirm that that is the issue.

2) There are log files in the radio..how do I access them?? Is there an app and do I download them?

3) The most important part!!!! The heli was originally setup with it being fairly accurate. Now that it's flying I want to redo the "Zero/collective and cyclic throws, using the "Soko pitch-gauge system".
So how am I able to get into the partial setup without having to start from dead scratch again???


Any info will be highly appreciated.

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540

Hi Alfred,

on models where space is an issue, an ESC with built-in telemetry would help, at least to get rid of the U/I-Sensor (which is only a small box in the battery wire, anyway). Battery ID is a different animal, but since I did never set up a Goblin I can not tell where I would put it.
My first approach would be to see where there is space left when I slide the canopy on, then to see if I can fit the sensor there so it has the proper distance to the battery plate.
What you can always do is remove the plastic cover for the electronics and shrink-wrap the board, if the plastic cover is a problem.

1) the log only shows events. If you want to do a vibration analysis, use the spektrum analyzer either on the bench / with the PC Software / without blades or carefully (control rod disconnected) with tail blades. You can also use it in flight and have somebody look or take screenshots, with VBar Control.
But vibration events are common once you "move" the model (do maneuvers), so as long as there are no issues (like drift) or unless you see vibration (like fins or control rods getting blurry, or the model shaking (which is more a wobble, not vibration in the sense we are analyzing), all should be well.

2) Check the archive (in the radio) or check the text files (on the disk of VBar Control).

3) Setup/Model Setup/Edit model setup, or Model Setup/Main Rotor.

Kind regards

Eddi

Born to fly ...
forced to work.

Thank you Eddie.
You confirmed my thoughts regarding point 3).
I now have the UI and ID installed and both are working.
In 4 flights with multiple landings, it showed just a total of 3 vib alerts, so all seems to be well.
The heli flies great with no negative effects even at high speed and high G Force turns. Using just tail, stationary pirouettes stay literally on the spot. Can it be even more improved?? I don't know. It already is up in the class of my MA Stratus 90 flybar that took months in fine tuning to get to this level.

Right now I am working on my custom VControl screens per model and switchable. Already tested and working...just fine tuning now for proper spacing on the screen.

As more as I use it as more I love the system. Just one thing in regarding custom screens.....the security lock is not there when I connect to my heli and the custom screens come into effect. My security Lock just shows on the default screen.

VBar Control (new)
JR DSX9 (Spectrum)
Helies:
SAB Goblin 770, VBar Silverline
Kasama Srimok 90N ECO (Nitro), Flybarless
MA Stratus 90 (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 Fury (Nitro) Flybar
MA 60 X-Cell (Nitro) Flybar
50 Extreme (Nitro) Flybarless, Skookum 720
50 Raptor (Nitro) Flybar
450 T-Rex (Electric) Flybarless, Skookum 540